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PostPosted: 29 Apr 2009, 06:09 
Hi folks,

I've tried to find out if neo-paganism is pro-sensual and pro-materialism.

Not in a negative way but in a responsible way.

The more I look into Buddhism it appears to me to be anti-sensual. To be sensual is seen as something bad. Attachment to sensual pleasure they say and all attachment is seen as suffering and one should avoid suffering at all cost. The sensual is seen as materalistic which to the them is illusion. Only the spiritual exists.

So I get curious on if neo-paganism are celebrating sensual pleasures like eating food and listening to music, dancing, playing music and singing and bodily pleasures like touching oneself and others and sex and all kind of intimacy. Does Pagans hug each other or do they stand far apart and do bowing and holding hands together to show respect and all touch is seen as being attached to sensual pleasures?

Both Buddhism and Christians seems to be against abortion even of if raped and getting pregnant that way. Are Neo-Pagans also like that?

Buddhists seems to be vegetarians. Neo_Pagans allow themselves to eat meat?

Final questions. Some Christians say that Pagan's gods are material. Or material in the sense of being "natural forces" and thus material in origin.

Looking forward to all kind answers.


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PostPosted: 29 Apr 2009, 08:37 
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standard disclaimer: no two neo pagans will agree on anything! ;)

A very quick answer--- neo pagans tend to see the world as a gift from the gods. Pleasures in it are meant to be enjoyed, short of causing others pain.

I guess, if you could picture Christianity if there was no fall from grace--- if people were still int he Garden and extolled to enjoy it. This place, here, is for some pagans, the promised land already.

Everything in it is meant to be enjoyed. Sec and food and drink are often parts of celebrations--- May Day and the summer solstice are both days sex is part of.

So, yes, neo pagans are probably pro-sensual and pro-materialistic.

I agree with Buddhism being anti sensual. But then, they view this life as something to work your way out of. Pagans do not always share that view, although some do.

There are no rules about abortion, that I am aware of. Most neo pagans are liberal, so I would see a correlation there, but not based on the religion.

Many pagans are vegetarians, and many eat meat. Again, I don't know of injunctions against killing and eating--- many feasts revolve around it--- but against wasting it.

Some Christians seem to think that if I have a statue of Hestia on my hearth, I obviously am worshiping the clay, not the concept. There is an idea that breaking the statue destroys the god. I have no clue where that could have come from--- I don't think even in India where they feed and bathe statues, they believe the clay is the deity. The clay merely is a temporary home for the deity if s/he wishes while visiting, at the most basic level, and a representation at a more common one.

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PostPosted: 29 Apr 2009, 10:11 
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Joined: 21 Jan 2009, 17:29
Posts: 4
Hi -- I'm a former pagan so I'll chime in.

Pagans come in many varieties since most sorts of it are not conformist or authoritarian. But for most, the senses are spiritual (as is meditation, ritual, and so on). The main rites can be taken as sexual, either symbolically, literally, or both.

Some are touchy-feely and like to hug and kiss, and some don't.

Most pagans eat meat, but some are vegan. Again, to each his/her own.

Most pagans are pro-choice -- but also "prolife" in other ways.

Most pagans don't draw a line between "natural" and "supernatural" -- all part of this universe -- although some others recognise other realms that aren't ordinarily perceived (whatever that means).

Ray

curiousatheist wrote:
Hi folks,

I've tried to find out if neo-paganism is pro-sensual and pro-materialism.

Not in a negative way but in a responsible way.

The more I look into Buddhism it appears to me to be anti-sensual. To be sensual is seen as something bad. Attachment to sensual pleasure they say and all attachment is seen as suffering and one should avoid suffering at all cost. The sensual is seen as materalistic which to the them is illusion. Only the spiritual exists.

So I get curious on if neo-paganism are celebrating sensual pleasures like eating food and listening to music, dancing, playing music and singing and bodily pleasures like touching oneself and others and sex and all kind of intimacy. Does Pagans hug each other or do they stand far apart and do bowing and holding hands together to show respect and all touch is seen as being attached to sensual pleasures?

Both Buddhism and Christians seems to be against abortion even of if raped and getting pregnant that way. Are Neo-Pagans also like that?

Buddhists seems to be vegetarians. Neo_Pagans allow themselves to eat meat?

Final questions. Some Christians say that Pagan's gods are material. Or material in the sense of being "natural forces" and thus material in origin.

Looking forward to all kind answers.


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PostPosted: 29 Apr 2009, 15:07 
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Postess
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Joined: 27 Sep 2007, 03:48
Posts: 1223
Location: The thousand acre wood
Quote:
standard disclaimer: no two neo pagans will agree on anything!


I disagree.

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PostPosted: 30 Apr 2009, 03:31 
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Guardian of the East

Joined: 22 Dec 2008, 02:47
Posts: 589
As to materialism, one must distinguish two types:
  • Metaphysical materialism
  • Ethical materialism
One can believe in one of these without believing in the other.


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PostPosted: 30 Apr 2009, 15:37 
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Grand Poobah
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Joined: 18 Sep 2007, 11:26
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ok, materialism for dummies, then please?

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PostPosted: 02 May 2009, 04:32 
"ok, materialism for dummies, then please?"

I need to be updated on that one too.

I failed to get the explanation. Meta what? I don't do meta ever.

I am an average Joe type here so no Meta me please.

Ethical materialism as in moral behavior sounds needed.

I don't like when they smash statues cause it seems very brutal to me.

Could be contagious too, next time the destroy the guy or "guy" that set up the statue.
Salman Rushdie and such authors who make things that others love to destroy.

I mean materialism as in lay person understanding of the difference between seeing a chair as possible to sit on if not broken and not the materialism that see it as empty space with fuzzy clouds of possible wave functions swirling around unpredictably until one "look" at them intensly.

To an average person the chair is as real as the body that want to sit on it.

Hahahah the Captcha or chaptcha is so hard to get that I feel like a webbot. :D

"The confirmation code you entered was incorrect."

No it was not! I do it again. No it was not again. Damn second time if fails


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PostPosted: 02 May 2009, 04:33 
lpetrich could you take sensual while you are at it too please!

I failed four times in a row to get the captcha


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PostPosted: 06 May 2009, 11:09 
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Guardian of the East

Joined: 22 Dec 2008, 02:47
Posts: 589
curiousatheist wrote:
"ok, materialism for dummies, then please?"

I hope that you can be patient with my attempts at explanation.

Quote:
I need to be updated on that one too.
I failed to get the explanation. Meta what? I don't do meta ever.
I am an average Joe type here so no Meta me please.

Wikipedia has this article on metaphysical materialism. It essentially holds that mind is not a primary substance, for lack of a better word, and that mind is a secondary feature, an emergent property. If you have ever played with construction toys when you were a little kid, you may have noticed that your constructions are assembled out of the parts that came in the toy box. So in a sense, the parts are the primary substance, while your constructions are the secondary features, the emergent properties.

Quote:
Ethical materialism as in moral behavior sounds needed.

I don't see how that is supposed to be the case.

Ethical materialism is what's often meant by "materialism"; it's the view that only material things are worth having.

Quote:
I mean materialism as in lay person understanding of the difference between seeing a chair as possible to sit on if not broken and not the materialism that see it as empty space with fuzzy clouds of possible wave functions swirling around unpredictably until one "look" at them intensly.

To an average person the chair is as real as the body that want to sit on it.

Quantum mechanics is just plain weird, but I don't think that quantum mechanics implies that observers have any sort of magic powers. I've seen lots of "mystic physics" woo-woo that claims that quantum mechanics demonstrates that wishing will make it so.


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PostPosted: 06 Jul 2017, 21:32 
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